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NothanUmber
6 discussion posts
Hi, using DisplayFusion for about a year now with my 34" 21:9 monitor to make better use of the available screen. Great program!
Am thinking about buying an OLED TV as monitor - probably I'm not the only one. Currently OLED screens have two problems in that scenario:
a) a 55" screen is very (too) big
b) burn-in is an issue in that scenario.
So offering special features that try to mitigate these problems could be an interesting selling point for an application like DisplayFusion.
For a we already have good solutions, allowing to define screen areas that don't fill the whole screen. So we can position windows in the comfort zones of the screen - having a big area doesn't mean it has to be used from end to end in all cases.
Not using the full area would also bring an additional advantage: The unused borders would allow to move the windows around slowly (following a pattern that the same virtual pixel is mapped to different real pixels as much as possible).
Of course this wouldn't give any guarantees (which you should clearly indicate so people don't even consider to sue you if they have burn-in problems). The risk is always on the side of the OLED buyer.
But it could be a super helpful feature that could be a lot more effective than the "few-pixels-shift" that the TVs do by themselves! (When allowing bigger borders).
Wouldn't work for fullscreen, but that should be ok - the most dangerous scenarios are probably stationary windows for office-style "non-movie/game" usage.
What do you think? Sounds like an idea?
Edit: Another useful feature along the same lines could be a "theme morpher/changer": If different colors are used for borders etc. it could further reduce overproportional usage of the same subpixels.
Aug 17, 2019 (modified Aug 17, 2019)
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#1
It's a neat idea! But this is something that would be really tricky to implement reliably. Moving windows around wouldn't be too bad, but it wouldn't help for things like the taskbar, desktop wallpaper, etc.
If this is something we're able to implement reliably in a future version, we'll be sure to let you know, but at the moment it's not something we'd be looking to add in the near future.
Thanks!
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NothanUmber
6 discussion posts
Thanks for considering!
Perhaps there could be an "OLED precaution mode" that can be enabled with one check-box that
a) disables all wallpapers (black)
b) sets task bars to auto-hide
c) hides all desktop icons
d) does the window-move thing
e) sets screen saver (black) to 5 min activation time
No guarantees, but this could be quite helpful already! (All but the window move stuff can essentially also be achieved without a dedicated program like DisplayFusion - but it wouldn't hurt to have such a one-click option.
All the best!
I'll put that on our feature request list, and if we're able to implement it in a future version, we'll be sure to let you know.
Thanks!
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Castlenock
5 discussion posts
Apologies to zombie a thread but wanted to say I think NothanUmber's points here are still relevant if not more so! I've been using my OLED TV for a monitor off and on for a while now and plan to almost continually use OLED when LG releases the 42" 4k panels in 2022.
DF is already crucial for providing monitor profiles and awesome wallpaper tools that relieve my OCD from burn-in anxiety but would love to vote for making any sort of script or feature for the increasing amount of OLED screen users concerned about burn in.
Long time user, adore the product!
Yep, same. Planning on getting an oled as pc monitor for gaming and work. Moving window capability to reduce burn-in would be awesome.
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sandmann
65 discussion posts
Except for the pixel shifting, there is nothing @NothanUmber suggests that you can't do now.
a) You can set the screensaver to blank or create a black image file to match your display's resolution.
b) Autohiding the task bar isn't enough because Windows leaves a 2 pixel line at the bottom. A program like ShyBar will hide that as well.
c) I have all desktop icons hidden all the time and have for years because the organization is a mess and they are distracting. I use Start Menu X/10 because it alphabetizes everything in one list so is fast to use. So I have a blank screen until I press the Windows key.
d) No pixel shifting in Windows yet. But, OLED TV's have a built-in option to pixel shift static images to reduce burn-in problems (at least newer ones do, mine's three years old). There is also a Refresh option in the Settings that does some behind-the-scenes magic. Takes about an hour to run and I use it ~twice a year. I don't know the impact of pixel shifting on games with static images. An action scene on a 4K screen I wouldn't think would be impacted much/if at all because thumbs and joysticks don't have that kind of control/resolution. Eyes do, thumbs don't.
Also, keep in mind there are static images, and there are static images. Airport displays never change except for a few characters on flight numbers, times, gates, and so on. Fatal for today's OLEDs. Using a program or game for a couple hours, then doing other things that are non-static, is very different. An airport OLED might last a few weeks or months. A game display, probably a lot longer. And if it lasts three years, how long do you typically keep your game monitor? Probably better to just view it as you do the console, as something that gets updated and replaced every few years.
e) You can set the screensaver time-to-activate to anything you want today.
I don't know which screensaver is better for OLED screens, black (blank) or a changing image. With old LED displays susceptible to burn-in, a changing image was best. Anyone know about this for OLED's?
All this is a long-winded way of saying that this issue is probably better handled by a monitor driver from the manufacturer, the game/program itself, or Windows. DF seems to me like the wrong place.
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Castlenock
5 discussion posts
I agree with Hoser's most recent take. IMO the biggest thing anyone can do to prevent OLED burn in is to be very mindful of brightness levels, if DF ever dips into HDR detection in its monitor profiles keeping OLED in mind when they design the UI would be great/much appreciated. HDR is max brightness and absolutely ups the game on how long something can be on the screen before it starts to offset things.
I do agree that DF shouldn't do all the heavy lifting for OLED panel remediation but I do think a lot of OLED friendly things can be in DF's wheelhouse. My main tool against burn in at the moment when I use it on my living room TV is DF - rotating backgrounds, some windows set ups where the task bar is flipped, items that Sandman recommended, etc. Things Hoser mentions would definitely be a good/great help at least for those of us with OCD burn in.
So I'm not asking for so much a feature request as asking for the developers to be aware that OLED as computer monitors is becoming a bigger thing. Anyway they can augment OLED stuff into their product design philosophy would be great. We're seeing a good bit of OLED laptops start to come out and I think we'll start to see some 42" OLED official desktop monitors in 2022 (based on the upcoming LG manufacturing of 42") with the market exploding in 2023 (as Samsung will officially be in the fray at that point as well).
Sandman, I've found the 2 pixel bar isn't nearly as bad as I had anticipated, especially if it's an LG panel - those have a white element in the RGB array and the bar peak is light grey so even in HDR mode it'd be difficult to make a dent. Smaller OLED displays (like my oled tablet where I use Moonlight to remote into my desktop) would be more effected by that small grey bar I think.
From what I've read it's better to have a rotating image / screensaver up, simply because it helps evenly wear the panel. The auto pixel refreshers (the ones that run when the TV is on standby, every 4 hours of watching and then a big one every 2k hours) seem to be a big part of what is keeping burn in away and I think it has an easier time of it if it has hundreds/thousands of hours of wear to evaluate rather than the occasional bit of light when you're actively using it. Not positive on that point, however.
Nov 14, 2021 (modified Nov 14, 2021)
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#10
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Léni
3 discussion posts
Have you been able to use it ? How has been your experience and with what kind of monitor ?
I also need those purchase advice lol
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hgc design
2 discussion posts
upvote here for the oled check option. really the only thing new would be the window movement(which was said to be easy) the other stuff would just trigger things that windows can already do just in a one stop shop type selection.